Exclusive Billionaire Interview with Pavan Agarwat
“When you’re weak, don’t bluff. Overselling your position burns years of trust.”
Pavan Agarwal is a rare combination of technologist, banker, and long-term operator who has spent decades working at the intersection of artificial intelligence, real estate, and financial services. Long before AI became a global phenomenon, Agarwal was writing his first AI programs while simultaneously helping his family build a real estate portfolio and scale what would eventually become Sun West Mortgage, a multi-billion-dollar national mortgage lender and servicer founded by his father, the late Hari Agarwal. This dual exposure to both cutting-edge technology and real-world finance gave him a deep understanding of how complex systems actually function—and where they fail consumers the most.
As a first-generation immigrant, Agarwal also understands firsthand what homeownership represents and how intimidating the process can be. That perspective has shaped his leadership as he engineered Sun West’s operations to reduce friction, lower costs, and improve outcomes for borrowers nationwide. In this Billionaires.com interview, Agarwal explains how that philosophy led to the creation of AngelAi, the world’s first fintech AI companion, and why true innovation in financial services isn’t about replacing humans, but about building trust, removing bias, and simplifying life-defining decisions. He also shares insights on scaling with integrity, thinking long-term through economic cycles, and why the future of AI belongs to those who deeply understand the industries they serve.
Richard Wilson:
He’s a visionary, investor, entrepreneur and banker, transforming real estate and finance through innovative AI technology. From writing his first AI program in 1985 to growing his family’s mortgage company, Sun West Mortgage, into a multi-billion dollar national lender, he’s blended tech and finance from the start. As a first-generation immigrant, he’s built Angel AI, the world’s first FinTech AI companion to simplify and humanize the path to ownership. With Angel AI’s true approval, Sun West fully warrants AI-driven lending decisions, extending fairness and access to all. Featured by Forbes, Fortune, and Bloomberg, his mission is to make financial opportunity and co-ownership available for every American.
The thing that I really loved about reading his background and really excited to have him with us here today is that I think the winners in AI are the ones adapting it to what they’ve been doing for 30 years. He has the technical capabilities behind him because it doesn’t matter if you get the sharpest nerd in Silicon Valley—they don’t have his three decades of experience in the mortgage space. He knows every little crook, crevice, and nuance of approving mortgages. That can’t be replaced by some super nerd backed by big Silicon Valley companies. The people who combine deep industry knowledge with technical capability are the ones who are going to win with AI implementation. So welcome. Thank you for being here.
Pavan Agarwal:
Thank you for having me.
Richard Wilson:
What would you add to your bio?
Pavan Agarwal:
I love super nerds, and I wish I was one. There are a lot of bright, inspired people out there doing massive innovation. The world is changing so fast—we’re talking about $15 trillion by 2030. If you do the math, that’s three trillion a year for the next few years. We need more super nerds.
Richard Wilson:
Great. I saw a stat the other day that OpenAI was doing $13 billion in revenue but spending $1.5 trillion. Someone asked how that was possible, and Sam said, “If you want to sell your shares, I have plenty of people that will buy them.” That just shows how fast the industry is growing. Looking back at your mortgage company—how did you go from a startup to breakout growth? What were one to three things you did to scale massively?
Pavan Agarwal:
I like to take credit, but my dad did all the hard work. He built the foundation. I’m second generation and worked by his side since I was a kid. He started it with less than $100,000. It was old-fashioned business—do it right, never lie, never break your word. That saved us in the 2008 financial crisis. We were down to our last $50,000. Trading partners who had worked with us for 20 years trusted us and helped us through.
Richard Wilson:
That’s awesome. I’ve seen similar situations where integrity and trust save businesses. Many times, companies survive because someone takes a leap of faith when they technically don’t have to.
Pavan Agarwal:
Exactly. When you’re weak, don’t bluff. Be honest with your trading partners, especially long-term ones. Overselling your position burns years of trust. I’m terrible at bluffing anyway, so I just say it as it is and hope the other person doesn’t take advantage of me.
Richard Wilson:
Warren Buffett says, “When the tide goes out, you see who was swimming naked.” In times like these, you see who was overleveraged. What gets your attention when someone approaches you without a big track record?
Pavan Agarwal:
Are they willing to work? Your biggest assets are your brain and your hands. If you have those, the rest works itself out.
Richard Wilson:
What would you say about managing mental models, especially with AI?
Pavan Agarwal:
AI isn’t a wave—it’s an ocean. People chase waves, but the winners focus on fundamentals. You can ride waves, but you need to build for the deep ocean if you want to last long-term.
Richard Wilson:
Your AI portfolio was valued over $100 billion. How much of that is patents?
Pavan Agarwal:
That valuation was just on the patents—didn’t even include operational value.
Richard Wilson:
Was there a key strategic asset that unlocked massive growth?
Pavan Agarwal:
Mindset. Going from thinking small to believing we could build something big. Once you flip that switch, actions follow.
Richard Wilson:
What actions followed that mindset shift?
Pavan Agarwal:
Nationwide marketing and being willing to experiment, even breaking even. Expanding perspective instead of avoiding all risk.
Richard Wilson:
What would you tell your younger self?
Pavan Agarwal:
Listen to yourself. Don’t chase shiny objects or other people’s methods. I’d be decades ahead if I’d stayed the course.
Richard Wilson:
Can you explain the core of your AI technology?
Pavan Agarwal:
It took decades to build. We developed decision engines piece by piece until they became one cohesive system. By 2019, we had a conversational engine used internally. Today, it’s fully conversational for consumers and professionals across mortgages, credit repair, insurance, taxes, and estate planning. Everything is stored in a single on-chain wallet, becoming your personal AI. The goal is for every human to have their own Jarvis.
Richard Wilson:
What’s the biggest mistake founders and investors make?
Pavan Agarwal:
Chasing waves instead of fundamentals. If you believe in the fundamentals, stay with it—even if timing isn’t perfect.
Richard Wilson:
Any unique strategies family offices should consider?
Pavan Agarwal:
I love real estate—consistent, predictable returns. Fixed income has incredible arbitrage opportunities if you understand the fundamentals. In tech, there are massive opportunities buying into great startups that can’t get funded, if you’re patient.
Richard Wilson:
Any final thoughts?
Pavan Agarwal:
Follow me on Instagram. I’d love to meet people here. If I make 40 new friends today, that’s a success.
Richard Wilson:
Thank you. Let’s give him a big round of applause.